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Old 04-13-2010, 12:15 PM
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The ugly side of animals……

Something out of a horror movie visited my apartment this morning. On two prior occasions a dog or dogs have charged up the steps (I live on the second story) and have barked at two cats, who we named Bones & Boothe, that live on our porch. On the second occasion Bones didn’t come home for half of the day. Early this morning however, a pack of dogs charged on the steps, barking ferociously. We heard Bones screeching like a banshee. Bones is an especially vicious cat so we thought the she would take care of business. At the first sound of dogs I heard though, I was unlocking the front door and preparing to charge them with the large heavy wooden cane the stands by the door. My mother however said that I should stay inside. So, not wanting to have any extremities ripped off, I did so. We could hear continued screeching and barking, but it seemed like the sounds where moving down the steps, towards the parking lot and ally/driveway behind our building. My grandmother comes running out of her room in the back yelling that the dogs have Bones, at which point my mother carefully opens the door, and sees a wide-eyed Bones setting to the porch. My mother now, who seems to have completely forgotten about her own safety, runs out of the apartment without a weapon of any kind, down the steps, and down to the ally/parking lot. My grandmother tells me that she saw the dogs tearing the cat to pieces from her window in the back. Right after she finishes talking, my mother come back up the steps crying, Boothe is barely alive. By now I’m thinking that our back ally/driveway is like a scene form F.E.A.R, blood everywhere and general carnage. My mother puts on a coat and leaves the apartment again, and when she comes back she tells us Boothe is dead. Fortunately, there is no such carnage, Boothe’s body has no physical sings of damage and there’s no blood anywhere. In all likelihood, Boothe had a heart attack and died of fear. As with most traumas, I’ve been replaying this scene in my mind wondering what would have happened of I had done things differently. One, I could have just charged out of the apartment with the cane in my hands yelling like a maniac. Two, some time ago I was debating weather or not to by an EXTREMLY sharp Japanese katana. It was only $50, but I decided that was two expensive. If I had the sword I would have charged out of the house with it screaming at the top of my lounges, grabbing at the cat, and slice n‘ dicing the dogs. This was one of those swords you see on TV that can cut down trees with one, maybe two blows. If I had It, I’m sure I would have saved the cat, and at least severely wounded the dogs. Three, If I didn’t live in California, I would have purchased an AR-15 or AK-47 the day after the first dog charged up our steps. If DID have a real-steal AR, I can almost guarantee that there would be one living cat, and four dead dogs. Lastly, I would have opened fire with my WA M4, it’s got an FPS of about 600, but I’m out of green gas right now. If I remember correctly, this same pack of dogs comes strolling through our apartment complex every so often, usually around this time of year. Of all the cats they could have killed, they had to kill boothe! She was always been our friendliest and most loveable kitty. Bones on the other hand, who is vary much alive right now, is an absolute witch! She’s bitten me and my mother a few times, and sent my grandmother to the hospital with an infected leg. I’m typing this while weighting for animal control to arrive. So I’m wondering, has anything like this happened to anyone else here? What can been done by animal control or the police? the dogs seemed to be well fed so they must have owner. If they do have an owner, is the owner liable? I've also heard of wild dog packs getting bigger and bigger, roming around the U.S. Thanks guys and gals for your input.
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Old 04-13-2010, 02:17 PM
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Originally Posted by Rain View Post
Two, some time ago I was debating weather or not to by an EXTREMLY sharp Japanese katana. It was only $50, but I decided that was two expensive. If I had the sword I would have charged out of the house with it screaming at the top of my lounges, grabbing at the cat, and slice n‘ dicing the dogs. This was one of those swords you see on TV that can cut down trees with one, maybe two blows. If I had It, I’m sure I would have saved the cat, and at least severely wounded the dogs.
Thats really a bad idea all around. First off any sword you buy today for less than a few hundred is going to be complete crap. I dont care what QVC or the ads said about the sword, it WILL NOT handle any serious stress and will either bend or break upon unleashing your fury. TRUST ME. Second the chances you will either cut yourself or be bit by a dog are pretty high in that scenario. Also the mess caused by such an course of action would be considerable.

The airsoft approach is much safer all around, as long as you are not brandishing your rifle for the world to see. You dont need to get close to said animals, lowering you own chance of injury and also applying a non lethal force to the dogs, whom I'm sure wont be thrilled about it. I'd suggest shooting from either inside or a window to avoid disturbing the neighbors too.
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Old 04-13-2010, 02:25 PM
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Mate with the dogs and in time your differences will be forgotten.
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Old 04-13-2010, 02:56 PM
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Since I had a hard time reading this, I will give you my idea on what I did read.

Shooting the animal or hacking it up could be cited as cruelty to animals, regardless of what you think might be the "right thing to do."

The last thing in the world you should do is grab a weapon and try to go out and kill them. That will come out badly for you and could lead to charges being filed against you.

It's also a blatantly stupid idea.

What you should do is contact the ASPCA, the Police, and/or Animal Control immediately and report the incident. This will get the Law involved so they can find out who owns the dogs and have them taken into custody.

Even when dogs attack other animals, it may be possible through proper channels to not resort to having to put the animals down. Depending on what Animal Control determines the correct action AND NOT YOU, it should be handled by them.

If they are attacking your animals or family on your property, by all means do what is necessary to protect you and yours, within reason. But running out the door with a sword or a rifle to chase after them is a good way for you to be shot, arrested, etc.

Lastly, using an airsoft gun for this is extremely stupid. If you don't have the proper weapon to take down the animal humanely, then you need to contact the proper authorities who can do so.

You have a legitimate complaint that can get the animals the help they need. Don't make a bad situation worse by exercising poor judgement.
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Last edited by Texx; 04-13-2010 at 03:02 PM.
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Old 04-13-2010, 03:05 PM
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Originally Posted by Son of Liberty View Post
Mate with the dogs and in time your differences will be forgotten.
Then you will always be there "b itch" har har har ..... sorry had to.
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Old 04-13-2010, 03:12 PM
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Mate with the dogs and in time your differences will be forgotten.
Then you'll be rich and famous for having the first dog/human baby!
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Old 04-13-2010, 03:24 PM
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Originally Posted by Texx View Post
Lastly, using an airsoft gun for this is extremely stupid. If you don't have the proper weapon to take down the animal humanely, then you need to contact the proper authorities who can do so.
I disagree. Using an actual firearm is more dangerous, kills the animal, gets the cops called, and will probably get you arrested. Using an airsoft gun might not be the best idea but atleast the animals arent dead in your yard and your neighbors wont keep the police on speed dial.

Besides calling the "authorities" isnt going to save the cat and that was Rain's original goal.
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Old 04-13-2010, 03:28 PM
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Texx, your absolutely right, but I didn’t mean that I would go looking for the dogs afterward and get revenge. I just meant that if I had a deadly weapon I would use it only while the dogs where still attacking, to save the cat. And yes I’m going to contact the police and see what can be done now. Also, the ally is only about 5 yards form my house, and they where still attack the cat which is, or was, my property. It's kind of like a guy who stand on his lawn and shoots holes on YOUR house. He's not on your property, but he still destroying it.

EDIT: SOL......you'r crazy!!!
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Last edited by Rain; 04-13-2010 at 03:46 PM.
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Old 04-13-2010, 03:32 PM
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I have called the authorities for many things including dogs at large. I have never gotten any results other than "I will take a report". That is why unless I am shot at I don't call the authorities for anything.

Try to find the owner and see what they have to say. Its always better to talk to the person you have problems with other than call the authorities. It is just the right thing to do....
If that doesn't work for me I go into Ninja mode and do what I gotta do.

Also don't use your airsoft gun to shoot the dogs...
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Last edited by hilljacked; 04-13-2010 at 03:36 PM.
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Old 04-13-2010, 03:41 PM
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At the very least, call the authorities and ask them to advise you on what to do next time this happens. Ask them if are you allowed to use deadly force to protect your animal. They'll know best.
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Old 04-13-2010, 04:09 PM
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Well I can only address the situation if it were to happen in Ohio. By STATE law ( meaning it applies all over the state) dogs must be confined to their yard, by chain, leash , or fence. The following is intended for farmers who lose livestock due to dogs running free. If it comes on your property and annoys you or your animals, then you have the right to shoot it. Now you might get busted for discharging a firearm within city limits
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Old 04-13-2010, 04:30 PM
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Here is the actual law on trespassing animals

(resource http://www.legislature.state.oh.us/index.cfm)

Sec. 959.04. Sections 959.02 and 959.03 Division (A)(2) of section 959.13 of the Revised Code and the prohibition against injuring or killing an animal established in division (A)(1) of that section do not extend to a person killing or injuring an animal or attempting to do so while endeavoring to prevent it from trespassing upon his the person's enclosure, or while it is so trespassing, or while driving it away from his the person's premises;, provided that within fifteen days thereafter, payment is made for damages done to such the animal by such the killing or injuring, less the actual amount of damage done by such the animal while so trespassing, or a sufficient sum of money is deposited with the nearest judge of a county court or judge of a municipal court having jurisdiction within such that time to cover such the damages. Such The deposit shall remain in the custody of such the judge until there is a determination of the damages resulting from such the killing or injury and from such the trespass. Such The judge and his bondsmen the judge's bondspersons shall be responsible for the safekeeping of such the money and for the payment thereof as for money collected upon a judgment.
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Old 04-13-2010, 06:05 PM
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To be honest, I found a number of things about this story a little disturbing.

Firstly, rain, an AR 15 or any other lethal weapon is not a good way to deal with a "pack" of dogs, as you described them. Why? Well, for all the reasons Texx listed, frankly. And if you are wondering about the "just plain stupid" part, he's right. Consider that dogs are PACK HUNTERS by nature. ie, Any close engagement will get you hurt or killed, and shooting at them with anything could get other people hurt or killed.

Secondly, the bit about the sword. A few things about this: just because a sword is sharp does not mean it is of good quality. There is a reason that swords that are useful nowadays go for at least a few hundred dollars, if not several thousand (though the latter are usually traditionally made swords in the Japanese style, and are sold as works of art). Also, have you ever studied the use of the sword? If I had to guess by the way you have written about it ("screaming at the top of my lounges, grabbing at the cat, and slice n‘ dicing the dogs") implies that you have not. Please don't assume that you understand how to use a weapon that I doubt you have ever handled. It is like a fifteen year old who has never held a gun claiming to be uber 1337 snyper! I am not trying to insult you, but please consider what I am saying.

Frankly, I have to agree with Texx. Call the authorities (who, by nature of being in an urban setting will likely be more helpful than authorities out in the country who usually expect us to deal with this sort of thing by our selves, and we can oblige). Where you live, this really is the best idea, because it solves the problem, and does so in a way that is least dangerous to all involved, including yourself. Frustration and foolish decisions are often coupled, but there is no reason to make the latter because of the former.
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Old 04-13-2010, 07:54 PM
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Well, I have handled a wooden sword, but I realized that the sword idea was a dumb one shortly after I posted. As for a firearm, I wouldn't have charged the dogs with it, I would have fired from a safe, distant, position. Anyway, thanks for all the input guys. I'll call the police and see what they can do.
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Old 04-13-2010, 09:30 PM
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Using an AR-15 or an AK-47 in a city environment/self defense is a great way to cause collateral causalities damage and hurt/kill someone.

Real guns are not airsoft. Think before you ever write something like that again.
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Old 04-13-2010, 10:02 PM
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What is this I don't even
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Old 04-14-2010, 12:38 AM
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1) No animal is worth a human life

2) using a actual weapon (real steel) of any sort is simply, stupid. I'm assuming you've never fired an actual weapon before... Lets take the AR for example: The round an AR shoots (.223 or 5.56) is a very deadly round and tavels at extreme velocities. Lets run a scenario for a moment...

You hear the dogs attacking the cat, you pick up your AR, go outside and start lighting the dogs up... Not only will the bullet be traveling so fast that it will pass right through the animal, most likely not causing much damage (unless you have considerable aim and manage to hit the dogs in the head) The round will be traveling so fast that it will almost definitely have one of two effects (if not both) 1: it ricochets off the floor of your apartment stairs, deck, etc and proceeds to endanger HUMAN lives. 2: it travels through both animal AND apartment stairs, deck, etc and hit's whatevers below you.

Dogs, especially wild dogs, are ferocious and should only be dealt with trained professionals IE law enforcement, animal control, etc.


Using a katana is ranked #2 on the list on ways NOT to handle a situation like that. So what if you managed to stab one dog - if you've ever seen actual stab victims it takes MANY stab wounds for someone ( or something ) to bleed out. As these dogs you're talking about are in a pack mentality most likely what would've happened is the rest of the pack would have turned on you... Good luck handling that many dogs.


Using any other means (besides contacting people trained to handle situations like the one you posted about) is ranked numbers 3- over 9,000.



Lastly but certainly not least, imagine if every cat in the world survived and was able to reproduce.... Cats would be the ones ruling the world and I don't know about you.... But have a bunch of ******* ruling the world would be the death of me! Dealing with women is bad enough

I can't reiterate enough how an animal will never be, and should never be, worth risking a human life.






Quote:
Originally Posted by hilljacked View Post
Here is the actual law on trespassing animals

(resource http://www.legislature.state.oh.us/index.cfm)

Sec. 959.04. Sections 959.02 and 959.03 Division (A)(2) of section 959.13 of the Revised Code and the prohibition against injuring or killing an animal established in division (A)(1) of that section do not extend to a person killing or injuring an animal or attempting to do so while endeavoring to prevent it from trespassing upon his the person's enclosure, or while it is so trespassing, or while driving it away from his the person's premises;, provided that within fifteen days thereafter, payment is made for damages done to such the animal by such the killing or injuring, less the actual amount of damage done by such the animal while so trespassing, or a sufficient sum of money is deposited with the nearest judge of a county court or judge of a municipal court having jurisdiction within such that time to cover such the damages. Such The deposit shall remain in the custody of such the judge until there is a determination of the damages resulting from such the killing or injury and from such the trespass. Such The judge and his bondsmen the judge's bondspersons shall be responsible for the safekeeping of such the money and for the payment thereof as for money collected upon a judgment.


He lives in California, The ORC doesn't apply to him
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...... Three, If I didn’t live in California, I would have purchased an AR-15 or AK-47 the day after the first dog charged up our steps.
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Last edited by Sparky; 04-14-2010 at 12:49 AM.
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Old 04-14-2010, 07:56 AM
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Rain I actually had a similar experience with my dog the other day. Lucy is a small to medium dog mutt. Here recently we have had a couple of the neighbor's dogs coming by, maybe she's in heat, I dont know. Anyway these dogs, usually only one, would come by and Lucy and my other dog (in a cage at night) would start barking relentlessly. This was at about 2 in the morning and I had an early class the next day. So I grabbed my KJW 1911 and went outside.

I found Lucy barking at another dog in the yard. I yelled at it to go away and go home. It didnt, threw my arms up to scare it away, stayed there. Then at about 40 ft shot it with the pistol in the hind quarter. It was enough for him to get the message and he left. Lucy stopped barking and I got some sleep.

So, I understand what you mean by wanting to protect your 4 legged family members. In my mind airsoft is the best last resort. I dont think you should kill an animal because their owner is unable to control them and they happened to range into your sites. You should have grabbed a pistol or AEG, hit them in the butt once our twice and they will run off, if not you keep shooting. Animals arent dumb, if something hurts they will usually want it to stop. Just dont shot for the face. And for those of you that say this is cruel to animals, remember we shoot people with the same airsoft guns every weekend.
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Old 04-14-2010, 01:05 PM
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"He lives in California, The ORC doesn't apply to him"

I was actually talking about MAC50's post!
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Old 04-14-2010, 02:02 PM
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My advice from a legal stand point is to involve the police, because taking matters into your own hands can and will get you in a lot of trouble. The only time you can injure or kill a dog is when it is about to cause harm to you or another person. That being said you need to call your local police station and file a report with them. They will most likely turn it over to a dog warden, but if it happens again and you press charges it will help your case.
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Old 04-14-2010, 02:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sparky View Post
1) No animal is worth a human life
disagee .
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Old 04-14-2010, 04:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hanlonb View Post
disagee .


Lol, seriously?

Ok... Next time you see a squrriel in the middle of the road, be sure to swerve and hit a car with a pregnant lady inside killing both her and her unborn child. How could you possibly try to disagree that an animal is worth more then a human life? If you kill an animal, at worst you may get a slap on the wrist... You kill a human being... You get 10-life in prison.
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Old 04-14-2010, 06:42 PM
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Old 04-14-2010, 07:03 PM
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Thread locked.. out of hand.

And hanlonb, Really? Wow...
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