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Old 09-20-2006, 04:23 PM
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Loki Loki is offline
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AEG Mini-Guide, Prices, Gearbox Information, etc.

The information contained in this post is nothing new, just trying to condense a few smaller things into one large post. I did not create this information, nor am I taking credit for it. -Loki


Saw it asked in another forum, and I thought this would be good to put out there. The question:

What version gear box does this gun use?
*note: Only considers the "classical" TM mechbox designs

Version 1

TM FAMAS

Version 2

TM Colt Series
TM G3 Series (including MC51)
TM MP5 Series (excluding PDW and K models)
CA Armalite Series
CA MP5 Series
G&G Colt Series
G&P Colt Series

Version 3

TM G36C
TM Sig Series
TM AK47 Series
TM Steyr
TM MP5K and MP5K-PDW

Version 4

TM PSG-1

Version 5

TM UZI

Version 6

TM Thompson
TM P90

Version 7
TM M14

This was originally posted by Goober, and updated by myself.

Foxtrot's Guide to AEG upgrades:

Alright so I thought I would write a guide to basic upgrading of AEGís. This all comes from my personal experience, and my research with these guns. Itís going to go by Brand, then gearbox version. Example: TM Ė V2 CA Ė V2 TM Ė V3 etc.

Lets start off here on a little basic background:

I like Promethous, Systema, and Guarder parts above all others. So, take that in account when reading this. Some parts can be interchanged with other brands, but these are from my trails what last the longest.

Different types of parts:

Aluminum piston head vs. Poly carb: Aluminum piston heads are naturally louder, making a bit of a clink each time they hit the gearbox. Now, this can add stress to the gearbox shell. In a v3 or a re-enforced V2 gearbox, this shouldnít be too much of a problem. A poly carb piston wonít add nearly as much stress to the gearbox, but it will wear out faster. Now, this is not good either, but for those who want a silent gun, this is the way to go. Examples of these would be the promethous POM piston head (A silent poly carb piston head) and the promethous aluminum piston head (thusly, by itís name).

Why I like non-linear springs, and why I like specifically guarder and promethous ones:
Iíve tried PDI, Iíve used Systema spring before, but in the end of things Iíve found that guarder and promethous springs are the best springs out there. They hold up for a LONG time, and they shoot at about what they say they will. Unlike PDI and Systema springs which can shoot any where +/- 50 FPS from where they should.

Hop up buckings: For 4$ you can afford to replace them. Itís good to replace them when ever you change an inner barrel. In my opinion, that is. Because then you get a new hop up bucking to start out with, stock CA hop up buckings last about 30,000 rounds. A guarder CLEAR hop up bucking should last effectively around 90,000 to 110,000 rounds Ė give or take. TM Stock ones, last some time too, I have not yet gotten down to an exact round count, but I would guess between 60,000 and 70,000 rounds.

Adding a tight bore: You can add a tight bore barrel into any gun you pretty much want. I donít think there is any common AEG exception to this. There are currently 4 main companies that make tight bore barrels for AEGís right now, Systema, Promethous, KM/Head 19.50, and Madbull. Here are the differences:
Systema: Barrel is made from Brass, and is a 6.04mm diameter. Normally run between 25$ and 35$

KM/Head 19.50: Barrel is made from brass, that is Teflon coated. They are NOT titanium. 6.04mm diameter, runs between 50$ and 75$

Promethous: Made from an electro glavined Stainless steel. Measuring 6.03mm inner diameter, normally runs between 50$ and 75$
Madbull: Newest on the market right now, they are made from what looks like an anodized aluminum. I havenít gotten any major reviews on them yet, nor have I gotten to use one yet (itís on my list of things to do) but it looks like they are going to be pretty good for the spiffy price. 6.03mm diameter, costing about 25$ depending on length.

Which tight bore barrel is the best? Well, out of all the reviewís Iíve read Ė favor points towards the Promethous one showing the best results. Iím getting one for my M14 here Ė 550mm to be exact, so we shall see what I think of it, when it comes in. Iím going to get a Madbull one for my M249, at 509mm, so I should be able to see the difference Ė if there is, between the two. But, for a good addition, Systema tight bores are a very good bang for the buck. I canít say too much about madbull right now since Iíve never used one.

Parts Companies:

Systema Ė Old school parts company, probably the most known name in airsoft Upgrading. They have the largest selection and verity of parts. If they donít make it for an AEG, youíre going to have a tough time finding it then. Extremely good company, highly recommended.

Guarder Ė Another Ďolderí company, but they just got into making AEG parts probably about a year and half, two years ago give or take. Theyíve made reliable pistons, piston heads, hop up buckings, and more. I have yet to use their gears, but I have no doubt they are good gears. Extremely good company, once more highly recommended.

Promethous Ė The new kid on the block. But theyíve been around for some time now under different names, I highly believe in promethous parts, everything Iíve read makes them extremely good. Their gears are very tough too. Iíve gone from Systema, to Guarder, To promethous. I still use the later two, but promethous is my new part of choice. But, they have a more limited selection then Systema and Guarder.

ANGEL Ė One of the lesser known companies, as well they have been around for probably 3 or 4 years now, I canít remember when exactly they first popped up online. Their parts are rare to see really. But, they are for the person who wants an Extremely high rate of fire, and not a high FPS. So, be weary when using them Ė they are NOT for upgraded springs. They are used for an extremely high ROF since their parts are ultra light.

There are other companies out there that make good/decent parts, but these are the ones I like to stick to for upgrading my guns. So, take that into account Ė this is my opinion. When I mention a certain brand below, feel free to take a look at any of these other companies to see what they offer, for what price too. Example of this is the Promethous POM piston head Ė Systema makes the same thing, called the Silicon Piston head Ė both are good parts, I just like promethous a little more, but Systema is a good brand too. Guarder makes their own poly carb piston head as well.

Gearbox types:

V1 Ė TM Famas series

V2 Ė TM Colt Series TM G3 Series (including MC51) TM MP5 Series (excluding PDW
and K models) CA Armalite Series CA MP5 Series G&G Colt Series G&P Colt Series

- Other V2 gearboxes: ICS Olympic Arms/Colt series (Colt series, being in Europe) Guarder V2 gearbox found in theirÖ Ďspecial guní

V3 - TM G36C, TM Sig Series, TM AK47 Series, TM Steyr, TM MP5K and MP5K-PDW, CA G36 Series, STAR G36 series, STAR UMP5, G&G UMG5

V4 Ė TM PSG-1

V5 Ė TM UZI

V6 - TM P90, TM Thompson

V7 Ė TM M14

Other Gearboxes:
KSC G33 gearbox Ė Assumed itís like the V2 gearbox, it just has someÖ special parts to it.
PGC/M249 Gearboxes: Yes, they have their own gearbox designs. Itís much different then a V3 or V6 or WHATEVER PEOPLE ARE COMPAIRING IT TO. So, for that matter it is its own gearbox.
Systema Gearboxes: I donít think Iím going to get into the PTWS upgrading, mainly because not enough people OWN a ptws to upgrade them, nor do I really know enough about them TO talk about it. Iíve played with them, taken them apart and such, but not internally enough to discuss it.
Tim Chan M14/STAR SOPMOD m14

Starting off Old school:

Tokyo Mauri Ė V1 Gearbox (Famas series)

Alrigth, this orignal gearbox isnít exactly too upgradeable. Now, with gears coming out for there newest V7 gearbox, we can hope they will also fit the orignal V1. But, it can be lightly upgraded Ė i.e. Not above 350 FPS. So, my parts list for it would consist of this:

Spring: Promethous/Guarder - MS100/SP100
Bushings: Guarder/Systema/Promethous - Metal bushings
Inner barrel: Systema or Promethous
Hop up bucking: Guarder

Depending on which brands you buy, this upgrade should cost between 75 and 125 dollars Ė going by Hong Kong pricing. It should effectively boost the FPS to about if not over 350 FPS Ė but with the V1 gearbox it will add a lot more stress on the internals. So, not highly recommended that you do any internal upgrades to the V1 gearbox. Now, doing an inner barrel and hop up bucking, is fine on it.

Tokyo Mauri Ė V2 Gearbox (M4/m16 series weapons, G3 series, Mp5 series, all other V2 gearboxes)

Oh the joy of this piece of crap gearbox. Excuse me there, I am just not a fan of TM v2 gearboxes. Too many hoooorrible experiences with them, anyways there is a method to their madness, just a rather picky one that normally happens to be on a case by case experience. So, hereís my experiences with them: They suck. But, you can upgrade them, with a bit more work.

Your basic 350 FPS upgrade:

Spring: Promethous/Guarder Ė MS100/SP100
Bushings: Guarder/Systema/Promethous

This upgrade will get you to 350 FPS, but how reliable? Well, itís hit and miss. Some peopleís guns will last for a long time with it, some peopleís will crack their gearbox or bust their spur gear in a day. Itís really hit or miss.

My recommendation for 350 FPS in a TM v2:

CA or Systema Re-enforced Mechbox shell
Promethous Re-enforced Spur gear or entire Gear set.
Spring: MS100/SP100
Guarder/Promethous metal bushings


My recommendations for a 370 to 400 FPS upgrade in a TM V2:

CA or Systema Re-enforced Mechbox shell
Promethous Re-enforced Spur gear or entire Gear set.
Spring: MS110/SP110
Guarder/Promethous metal bushings
Promethous hard piston
Promethous aluminum piston head with bearings or POM piston head with bearings.
Guarder V2 Spring guide with bearings.

Recommendations for 380 to 410 FPS upgrade in a TM V2:

CA or Systema Re-enforced Mechbox shell
Promethous Re-enforced Spur gear or entire Gear set.
Spring: MS120/SP120
Guarder/Promethous metal bushings
Promethous hard piston
Promethous aluminum piston head with bearings or POM piston head with bearings.
Guarder V2 Spring guide with bearings.


A little more pricey upgrade, probably going to cost you between 50$ for the barebones upgrade, to 200$ for the complete upgrade depending on what you want to do with the gun and what parts you want with it as well. But, remember the more you replace the more chances itís going to be reliable.

As well, a perfectly viable option for this now is the Systema Pro-Gear re-enforced PREBUILT mechboxes. I donít have the exact numbers of what they cost, but for the money you get a completely new gearbox, all re-enforced and pre-upgraded to a certain FPS. As well, itís just a straight drop into a TM Gun. So, a very good choice for those of you who still sue TM Guns.

ICS V2 split gearbox typeÖ

Once more, a bit harder depending on the upgrade:

350 FPS upgrade:

Spring: Guarder/Promethous SP100/MS100
Bushings: Systema or Guarder Metal bushings (6mm)

Pretty easy for 350 fps, might want to start using a 9.6v battery in the ICS Gun now.

400 FPS~ish is a lot more complicatedÖ

Piston: Promethous Hard Piston
Piston head: Promethous Aluminum or POM piston head with bearings
Spring: Promethous/Guarder SP110/MS110 (for 370~ish FPS) or SP120/MS120 (For 400~ish)
ICS Version 2 Bearing Spring Guide with Screw
Systema or Promethous bushings (6mm)
Systema Shims
Promethous orignal ratio or Torque up ratio gears
TM or Systema Upgrade motor (EG1000 OR a Systema motor (Genie, etc.) )

Classic Army Re-enforced V2 gearbox:

Alright, not a whole heck of a lot you need to do to these, especially the CQB/r That has pretty much everything already installed you would need to upgrade.

So for any Classic Army new gun (i.e. Newest series M15 rifle, OR CQBr) all you need to do is add a spring:

350 FPS Ė Guarder/Promethous SP100/MS100
370 FPS Ė Guarder/Promethous SP110/MS100
400 FPS Ė Guarder/Promethous SP120/MS120

Ok, now that weíve pretty much covered V2ís time to move onto V3ís.

TM V3 upgrades:

A lot easier then TM V2ís, since the gear box is re-enforced, and easier to work with in general, basically itís not a piece of wank like the TM V2ís are.

For a 350 FPS upgrades, this is what I would do:

Spring: Guarder/Promethous SP100/MS100
Bushings: Guarder/Promethous/Systema Metal bushings

370/400 FPS upgrades:

Spring: Guarder/Promethous SP110/MS110 (370~ish) or SP120/MS120 (400~ish)
Bushings: Guarder/Promethous/Systema metal bushings
Piston: Promethous Hard Piston
Piston Head: Promethous Aluminum piston with bearing or POM piston head with bearings
Spring guide: Guarder or Promethous V3 spring guide with Bushings

CA V3 Upgrades:

Pretty simple right now, same as the V2 upgrades for a CA Gun. The internals are already re-enforced, and they come with 7mm metal bushings already installed as well, so heres what I suggust:

350 FPS: Guarder/Promethous SP100/MS100
370 FPS: Guarder/Promethous SP110/MS110
400 FPS: Guarder/Promethous SP120/MS120

OkÖ I think that covers the V3 gearboes.

PSG-1 V4 Ė Of course, TM makes another wanky gun.

Alright the PSG-1ís gearbox is a complete totalÖ screw up. Best way to upgrade a PSG-1 is to find, and then thusly purchase a Systema PSG-1 Full Tune Kit. Since the PSG-1 uses specialty parts, and itís the ONLY gearbox to do this right now, itís then thusly just better to replace everything then trying to dig up just one part for it.

I canít say I know the exact FPS for what percent spring does what in the PSG-1, but from spring/bolt action guns itís normally like this:

300% = 550~ish FPS
250% = 500~ish FPS.

So your best bet would be to go with either a 300% or a 250% spring.

V5 Ė TM UZI

Canít be upgraded. Iím sorry, itís a plastic gearbox shell, not a single company makes metal replacement ones for it. You canít upgrade them, not even with an M100. Itís just too weak to take it. Iíve had heard stories of people putting bushings and an M100 in them but those stories normally end up with a broken gearbox too. So I canít recommend you upgrading them.

V6 Ė TM P90 and TM Thompson

Ok back to a decent designed gearbox again.

Both of these guns take a different kind of bushings, so you have to make sure you need to get the special V6 kind of bushing for these guns.

So, hereís a list of what to do for 350 fps:

Systema V6 Gearbox type Metal bushings
Spring: Guarder/Promethous SP100/MS100


For 370 to 400 FPS:

Systema V6 Gearbox type Metal bushings
Spring: Guarder/Promethous SP110/MS110 or SP120/MS120
Promethous Hard Piston
Promethous POM Piston head with Bearing or Aluminum Piston head with Bearings

I believe the V6 gearbox uses the V3 spring guide, but I am not 100% sure on that. But, either way you donít really need to replace the spring guide unless you want to, the V6 gearboxes seem to be pretty tough. But, replacing it would be a good idea. Iím sure you could easily mod a V3 spring guide to fit in it, if needed too.

V7 Ė TM M14.

Alright, not a lot of parts out for this yet. So I canít really comment on it too much. Iíll mod this once more parts for the M14 are out.


PGC/Classic Army M249 gearbox:

Most people toying with a PGC gearbox already know what they need to do with them, so Iíll skip over that part for now. Onto the classic Army m249 gearbox.

Not a heck of a lot needs to be done to get a Classic Army m249 gearbox into awesome performance. The CA m249 gearbox is one of those things, the less you mess with it, the less chance of it breaking. I ran mine so far, 200,000 rounds over 3 different springs with out a problem in it. All the ones Iíve seen break, people have messed with. So, here is what Iím suggesting:

330 FPS Ė Guarder/Promethous SP100/MS100
350-370 FPS Ė Guarder/Promethous SP110/MS100
370-410 FPS Ė Guarder/Promethous SP120/MS120

The less you do to the M249ís gearbox, the less it will break. I know the piston in mine will go out eventually, and the strongest piston to replace it with is the Promethous Hard type piston (Iíve recommended above, a lot.) Another good piston is the Guarder Blue piston, and the Systema BLACK piston.

I think that covers all the gearboxes I know about/Willing to talk about Ö if you have any questions feel free to ask me. This should be a general guide to what parts to look at. As I said above, there are different brands that make the same parts, feel free to look at them. I highly recommend Promethous, Guarder and Systema Parts.

I will continue to expand onto this whenever I come by new information, or a new type of gearbox comes out, etc.

Special thanks:

Nextmayor: For his ICS M16ís upgrade list of parts. I modded it a little to what I would do, but generally the same parts

Austinwolv: For his list of parts and his reviews and tests of all the different parts.

HissingSid (from www.ArniesAirsoft.co.uk): For his review of tight bore barrels and his general testing of a ton of guns.

Wallace: For his help with me not getting a PSG-1 way back in the day, advising me against it because of how complex they are

End notes: All of this is in the opinion of my mind, what parts are best with what combination. All the experiences have been either my OWN experience or of someoneís experience that I highly trust and/or reguard their opinion in this matter. Take this as you wish, but itís just how I think about it. As well, sorry for any grammar or spelling mistakes on here, I am not the worldís greatest person when it comes to either of those subjects.

The following was originally Posted by DeltaSniper
Where can I get the best price for any AEG?

Next to what gun is best and what gun would you like to see, Where can i buy the cheapest AEG is the most popular newb question.

Fact being told, thats really hard question for anyone to answer, and an easy question at the same time.

Its hard because of the following reasons:

-AEG prices fluctuate. Keep in mind that even US retailers are getting them from overseas in HK. Those retailers in HK are getting them from Japan directly. There are a lot of middle men involved
-Stocks of guns fluctuate. If I tell you Frank at Combat Depot has the best price stateside on X aeg, and you order it from him. He might not have it in stock. He may have sold his last one that day. Wah-Wah! Youre SOL until he gets another one.

Its easy because of the following reasons:

-You can do your own research, something we highly encourage here.
-We have no inside links to airsoft retailers that you dont have. We see the same prices and webpages that you do. As veterans, there is no "veterans only" store. What you see is what you get.

As a result, I am going to ask people to not post questions regarding the price of AEGs here in this forum. Any questions or comments, please PM me.
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Old 04-21-2007, 11:05 PM
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never really had to upgrade b4 thought i would try it

if i am upgrading to 120spring should i keep my polycarb piston and the same ca bushings and gears or should i upgrade ? i got a 9.6volt3300mah battery i think it should be able to handle the 120 and keep a good rof right??

help? you seem to know what you are talkin about
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Old 04-21-2007, 11:55 PM
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One, please dont post on this. It will be edited here soon and these two threads deleted.

Poly carb piston is fine, it will wear out, but so does everything. Gears and bushings are fine. Your battery is fine.
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